NYCPHP Meetup

Fri Jun 25 12:48:40 EDT 2010

Gary, I agree that joomla's core email functionality is limiting and
have often wondered why no one has addressed the issues you mentioned
with a 3rd party pro extension (commercial or non-commercial).
Particularly the "combine forum messages". For the user receive
options, there exists bits and pieces, but no single solution. The
existing pro jooma options are very article-based newsletter focused,
with the assumtion that email with the option of rich or html is
enough. Granted, for most basic joomla installations, it may be the
case, but with all of the major social networking, e-commerce and news
sites offering multiple message reception options, the users
expectations will become more demanding. Any serious project (joomla
or something else) will need to be mindful of this shift.

Yes, it does suck that this is already possible in Drupal (among other
things). If you were to ever decide to construct this and enable its
management through an admin interface that doesn't require coding to
manage the options...you could count me and few other devs I work with
as customers.

-Arzie

On 6/25/10, joomla-request at lists.nyphp.org
<joomla-request at lists.nyphp.org> wrote:
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> Today's Topics:
>
>    1. Re: cloudaccess.net (Paul Elliott)
>    2. Gawd! I hate Drupal!!! (Gary Mort)
>    3. Re: Gawd! I hate Drupal!!! (Paul Bouzakis)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Thu, 24 Jun 2010 12:54:04 -0400
> From: Paul Elliott <joomlanyc at upshotmagazine.com>
> To: "NYPHP SIG: Joomla" <joomla at lists.nyphp.org>
> Subject: Re: [joomla] cloudaccess.net
> Message-ID: <5187624B-52F5-4FE1-9572-4DE844A39050 at upshotmagazine.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
>
> Thanks Mitch,
> I'm searching for a good cloud hosting solution and the Joomla connection
> cloudaccess.net offers is a pretty good catch.
> Paul
>
> On Jun 24, 2010, at 10:16 AM, Mitch Pirtle wrote:
>
>> On Wed, Jun 23, 2010 at 3:54 PM, Paul Elliott
>> <joomlanyc at upshotmagazine.com> wrote:
>>> Has anyone used cloudaccess.net?
>>> I think i remember them giving a presentation at a Joomla NYC meeting
>>> last year.
>>> Are they an actual web hosting provider or are they in some sort of
>>> partnership (maybe reseller) with a provider?
>>
>> CloudAccess is a premier hosting company that is also a huge supporter
>> of the Joomla project. Gary Brooks is personally involved in the
>> project as well.
>>
>> They basically have built their own private cloud infrastructure and
>> have hotrodded Joomla to take advantage - so you can launch your
>> Joomla site and expand/contract your hosting resources at will.
>>
>> Not affiliated, just friends with Gary and a cheerleader as I think
>> they are doing good things.
>>
>> -- Mitch
>> _______________________________________________
>> New York PHP SIG: Joomla! Mailing List
>> http://lists.nyphp.org/mailman/listinfo/joomla
>>
>> NYPHPCon 2006 Presentations Online
>> http://www.nyphpcon.com
>>
>> Show Your Participation in New York PHP
>> http://www.nyphp.org/show_participation.php
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Fri, 25 Jun 2010 09:33:56 -0400
> From: Gary Mort <garyamort at gmail.com>
> To: "NYPHP SIG: Joomla" <joomla at lists.nyphp.org>
> Subject: [joomla] Gawd! I hate Drupal!!!
> Message-ID:
> 	<AANLkTinQyblnC92aMkmON1rUUxR9QLRO_75Z9fo6f0jW at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> As my dayjob involves email deliver-ability,  I have long loathed the Joomla
> Email functionality.
>
> It is extremely basic, locked into specific and downlevel email
> libraries[PHPMailer for the longest time was languishing in obscurity and
> far outpaced by Swiftmail in functionality.  Now the reverse is happening
> and new versions of PHPMailer are getting the functionality.  Yet still
> Joomla is stuck with an old old version of PHPMailer].
>
> Plus it is extremely limiting, in my mind, for a component to send email
> directly to users.
>
> To me, a much better model would be as follows:
>
> $userMessage = new JMessage;
>
> $userMessage->setRecipient($joomlaUser);
> $userMessage->setSender($joomlaUser);
>
> // HTML message suitable for web or email
> $userMessage->setRichHTML('some html formatted email');
>
> // HTML message suitable for Cell or PDA
> $userMessage->setBasicHTML('some html formatted message');
>
> //Long Text Message
> $userMessage->setLongText('some long text message');
>
> //Medium text message
> $userMessage->setMediumText('some short summary message, max of 1024
> chars');
>
> //Short text message
> $userMessage->setShortText('some short text message, max 230 chars');
>
> //Add some files
> $userMessage->attachFile($fileHandle);
>
> // Optionally, set a preferred medium
>
> $force=false;
> $preferred='email';
>
> // What kind of message is this?  Types could be confirmation, normal, or
> batch
> $type='normal'
>
> // Send the message
> $userMessage->sendMessage($type, $preferred, $force);
>
>
> So that basically, when you get to the send message part, the message is
> saved to a messaging queue table and based on the recipients preference,
> they can receive the message in a number of different ways.
>
> If they prefer to receive notices by IM or SMS text message, then you send
> them the short text message with a link to the rich html version online.
>
> If they prefer email, then you send a MIME email with the rich HTML and the
> basic Text.
>
> If the user has a flag set for text only, and you have a text version send
> just the text.
>
> If the user has a flag set for low impact html, or wants an MMS, send the
> basic html.
>
> If they prefer private internal message, you can send it to the internal
> system, which may trigger a new round of notifications being sent.
>
>
> [Note: the type of message is important, primarily to differentiate between
> batch notices like "a forum thread you posted to has been updated" and "new
> content has been added to this section"...and messages like "confirmation of
> your order"....  For batch notices, one could allow a user to have
> additional settings such as "only send me batch notices once an hour or once
> a day".... so instead of getting 50 forum update notices, they will get one
> notice at the end of the hour the first one is put in the queue with all the
> medium text fields appended together].
>
> So, why do I hate drupal?  Because someone has already done it!
> http://drupal.org/project/messaging
>
> *sigh*     Now, I was willing to code all that for my own usage....  but
> figured no one else would ever use it....  But if it already exists, there
> isn't much reason for me to code it for Joomla.... :-(
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Fri, 25 Jun 2010 10:10:52 -0400
> From: Paul Bouzakis <nyphp at zooluserver.com>
> To: joomla at lists.nyphp.org
> Subject: Re: [joomla] Gawd! I hate Drupal!!!
> Message-ID: <4C24B8EC.8050901 at zooluserver.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"; Format="flowed"
>
> I am new to Joomla as I am still learning the ins and out of the
> cms/framework, but one thing I do know is that we should not have to
> reinvent the wheel.
> We should be able to add vendor libraries into Joomla like Zend
> Framework or Symfony Components.
> In this example you could use the Zend_Mail class which has a similar
> interface to the one you describe.
>
> Maybe this is possible in Joomla, I just haven't seen it.  Should be
> easy enough with Zend's Autoloader.
>
> On 6/25/2010 9:33 AM, Gary Mort wrote:
>> As my dayjob involves email deliver-ability,  I have long loathed the
>> Joomla Email functionality.
>>
>> It is extremely basic, locked into specific and downlevel email
>> libraries[PHPMailer for the longest time was languishing in obscurity
>> and far outpaced by Swiftmail in functionality.  Now the reverse is
>> happening and new versions of PHPMailer are getting the functionality.
>>  Yet still Joomla is stuck with an old old version of PHPMailer].
>>
>> Plus it is extremely limiting, in my mind, for a component to send
>> email directly to users.
>>
>> To me, a much better model would be as follows:
>>
>> $userMessage = new JMessage;
>>
>> $userMessage->setRecipient($joomlaUser);
>> $userMessage->setSender($joomlaUser);
>>
>> // HTML message suitable for web or email
>> $userMessage->setRichHTML('some html formatted email');
>>
>> // HTML message suitable for Cell or PDA
>> $userMessage->setBasicHTML('some html formatted message');
>>
>> //Long Text Message
>> $userMessage->setLongText('some long text message');
>>
>> //Medium text message
>> $userMessage->setMediumText('some short summary message, max of 1024
>> chars');
>>
>> //Short text message
>> $userMessage->setShortText('some short text message, max 230 chars');
>>
>> //Add some files
>> $userMessage->attachFile($fileHandle);
>>
>> // Optionally, set a preferred medium
>>
>> $force=false;
>> $preferred='email';
>>
>> // What kind of message is this?  Types could be confirmation, normal,
>> or batch
>> $type='normal'
>>
>> // Send the message
>> $userMessage->sendMessage($type, $preferred, $force);
>>
>>
>> So that basically, when you get to the send message part, the message
>> is saved to a messaging queue table and based on the recipients
>> preference, they can receive the message in a number of different ways.
>>
>> If they prefer to receive notices by IM or SMS text message, then you
>> send them the short text message with a link to the rich html version
>> online.
>>
>> If they prefer email, then you send a MIME email with the rich HTML
>> and the basic Text.
>>
>> If the user has a flag set for text only, and you have a text version
>> send just the text.
>>
>> If the user has a flag set for low impact html, or wants an MMS, send
>> the basic html.
>>
>> If they prefer private internal message, you can send it to the
>> internal system, which may trigger a new round of notifications being
>> sent.
>>
>>
>> [Note: the type of message is important, primarily to differentiate
>> between batch notices like "a forum thread you posted to has been
>> updated" and "new content has been added to this section"...and
>> messages like "confirmation of your order"....  For batch notices, one
>> could allow a user to have additional settings such as "only send me
>> batch notices once an hour or once a day".... so instead of getting 50
>> forum update notices, they will get one notice at the end of the hour
>> the first one is put in the queue with all the medium text fields
>> appended together].
>>
>> So, why do I hate drupal?  Because someone has already done it!
>> http://drupal.org/project/messaging
>>
>> *sigh*     Now, I was willing to code all that for my own usage....
>>  but figured no one else would ever use it....  But if it already
>> exists, there isn't much reason for me to code it for Joomla.... :-(
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> New York PHP SIG: Joomla! Mailing List
>> http://lists.nyphp.org/mailman/listinfo/joomla
>>
>> NYPHPCon 2006 Presentations Online
>> http://www.nyphpcon.com
>>
>> Show Your Participation in New York PHP
>> http://www.nyphp.org/show_participation.php
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[joomla] Gawd! I hate Drupal!!!